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	<title>Comments on: Time For a Third Party?</title>
	<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/</link>
	<description>When I wake up I read the Bible and the newspaper... because I want to know what both sides are up to.</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 20:47:59 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: Texas Rainmaker &#187; Early 2008 Prediction</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-17008</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Nov 2006 22:59:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-17008</guid>
					<description>[...] With 2006 all but in the record books, I&#8217;m going to take a leap and make a prediction for 2008. Back in June, I discussed the possibility that America is ready for a viable third party. I linked to a Peggy Noonan article that said the problem &#8220;is not that the two parties are polarized. In many ways they’re closer than ever.&#8221; I think we saw the evidence last night. Conservatives came out and voted for conservative candidate&#8230; on both sides of the aisle. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] With 2006 all but in the record books, I&#8217;m going to take a leap and make a prediction for 2008. Back in June, I discussed the possibility that America is ready for a viable third party. I linked to a Peggy Noonan article that said the problem &#8220;is not that the two parties are polarized. In many ways they’re closer than ever.&#8221; I think we saw the evidence last night. Conservatives came out and voted for conservative candidate&#8230; on both sides of the aisle. [&#8230;]
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		<title>by: Texas Rainmaker &#187; The MSM&#8217;s Campaign of Death by a Thousand Elections</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-8923</link>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Jul 2006 13:05:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-8923</guid>
					<description>[...] The follow up question then, shows that the two major parties only see a &#8220;strong&#8221; following by 17% and 21%, respectively. The move to the middle, or possible third party ground is rather significant - 62%. Something I addressed last month. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] The follow up question then, shows that the two major parties only see a &#8220;strong&#8221; following by 17% and 21%, respectively. The move to the middle, or possible third party ground is rather significant - 62%. Something I addressed last month. [&#8230;]
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		<title>by: Judith</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4484</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 02 Jun 2006 04:40:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4484</guid>
					<description>I agree Old Soldier.  With all the divergent Republicans we need a bigger tent or we all need to get together.  Each faction of the party cannot have it all their way--and that is where some conservatives really rankle me.  There are things that I disagree with W or the Congress about, but I can live with it because the alternative to sitting at home on election day on my behind--IS THE LIBERALS--and that thought would and should gag a maggot.  Repubs better think long and hard about this, either my way or the highway.  That road we have been down before.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree Old Soldier.  With all the divergent Republicans we need a bigger tent or we all need to get together.  Each faction of the party cannot have it all their way&#8211;and that is where some conservatives really rankle me.  There are things that I disagree with W or the Congress about, but I can live with it because the alternative to sitting at home on election day on my behind&#8211;IS THE LIBERALS&#8211;and that thought would and should gag a maggot.  Repubs better think long and hard about this, either my way or the highway.  That road we have been down before.
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		<title>by: Old Soldier</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4459</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 23:22:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4459</guid>
					<description>I seems like since Newt left the House, the "kids" are acting up doing as they please.  I'm tired of RINOs deciding what is best for me.  If I wanted to live under socialism, communism, a dictatorship of some other form of government, I'd move.  I just want the elected representatives to remember who elected them and start acting like representatives, not elitists.

Is another party the answer?  Not if the Republican politicians will recall their roots and start acting like Republicans.  I believe there are a lot of centrists that would regualrly vote GOP if the GOP representatives remained faithful to their doctrine and their electorate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I seems like since Newt left the House, the &#8220;kids&#8221; are acting up doing as they please.  I&#8217;m tired of RINOs deciding what is best for me.  If I wanted to live under socialism, communism, a dictatorship of some other form of government, I&#8217;d move.  I just want the elected representatives to remember who elected them and start acting like representatives, not elitists.</p>
<p>Is another party the answer?  Not if the Republican politicians will recall their roots and start acting like Republicans.  I believe there are a lot of centrists that would regualrly vote GOP if the GOP representatives remained faithful to their doctrine and their electorate.
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		<title>by: David</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4457</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 21:19:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4457</guid>
					<description>Karl:

You don't need 50% +1 in the presidential election.  Clinton never got 50%, and W. didn't get 50% the first time.  In many states (including Texas) you don't need 50% in the general election -- you only need to finish first.  In fact, many observers believe that the winner of the Texas governor's race will get under 40% -- and even the most optimistic predict a winner with less than 45%.

That may be a big part of why the independent movement is so strong in Texas.

Some states do require 50%+1.  (Lousisiana does, but has a open election in November, followed by the top two finishers -- not necessasrily from different parties -- in December.)  But not all states have this requirement.  And the presidency never has.  Lincoln got (IIRC) around 40%.  Woodrow Wilson was also a minority president, as was JFK, and IIRC, Nixon in '68.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Karl:</p>
<p>You don&#8217;t need 50% +1 in the presidential election.  Clinton never got 50%, and W. didn&#8217;t get 50% the first time.  In many states (including Texas) you don&#8217;t need 50% in the general election &#8212; you only need to finish first.  In fact, many observers believe that the winner of the Texas governor&#8217;s race will get under 40% &#8212; and even the most optimistic predict a winner with less than 45%.</p>
<p>That may be a big part of why the independent movement is so strong in Texas.</p>
<p>Some states do require 50%+1.  (Lousisiana does, but has a open election in November, followed by the top two finishers &#8212; not necessasrily from different parties &#8212; in December.)  But not all states have this requirement.  And the presidency never has.  Lincoln got (IIRC) around 40%.  Woodrow Wilson was also a minority president, as was JFK, and IIRC, Nixon in &#8216;68.
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		<title>by: Karl Gallagher</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4450</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 16:35:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4450</guid>
					<description>The 50%+1 voting system drives us to a two-party system.  If we want to change that &lt;a href="http://libertarianhawk.livejournal.com/10312.html" rel="nofollow"&gt;we'll need to change the system first&lt;/a&gt;.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The 50%+1 voting system drives us to a two-party system.  If we want to change that <a href="http://libertarianhawk.livejournal.com/10312.html" rel="nofollow">we&#8217;ll need to change the system first</a>.
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		<title>by: David</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4449</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 16:18:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4449</guid>
					<description>I think the start-up and time and money (particularly money) required is less now than it was when Perot ran.  And there are nascent independent movements (in Texas we have two credible independent candidates for governor, both of whom are likely to out-poll the Democratic Party nominee) which can be co-opted or cooperated with as a source of volunteers.  While many of the Perotistas have returned to their natural home in the GOP (including Perot's 1992 campaign manager, who made an unfortunate pit stop as the 1994 Dem Senate nominee against Kay Bailey Hutchison, but who is now a prominent Republican, and ranking Federal Reserve official in Dallas), they and other disaffected voters are primed to move over the illegal immigration issue.

But when will they move?  In many states, including Texas, the filing deadline has passed.  Some of them may vote Dem this fall out of frustration, but the Democratic Party is no longer the natural home of anyone opposed to increased Balkanization of America.  In effect, I believe this gives the GOP two years to make a substantial move to the right on immigration enforcement.  The GOP may lose the House in the meantime, however, and that means that the amnesty forces will be the only Republicans with national power.  

The combination of these effects should propel Tom Tancredo (or someone very much like him) into the front rank of GOP presidential candidates in '08, though he will ultimately prove unsuccessful.  The question then for the GOP is: do they put Tancredo on the ticket in the number two spot, or do they risk the emergence of a third-party challenger on this issue, and lose enough votes (a la Perot) to guarantee a Hillary victory?

In any event, given the onerous requirements of signature gathering, a third party candidate (Chris Simcox, perhaps?) would have to begin organizing his/her efforts no later than the last quarter of '07.

Tying this issue to the bloat in the federal government, and making the point (as has been made recently by a number of Washington think-tanks and some conservative columnists and bloggers) that amnesty and increased immigration will bloat the welfare state and balloon its costs might give the third party not only more echo of Perot on the issues, but it would also serve to lance the claim of Republicans that they are the party of fiscal responsibility.  This would also bolster the candidacy of Hillary, as Bill presided over years of fiscal surplus.

In any event, it seems virtually impossible for the GOP to win in '08 without adopting the current House bill on immigration enforcement or something quite similar.  Amnesty (heavy or light) appears to be High-Caliber suicide.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the start-up and time and money (particularly money) required is less now than it was when Perot ran.  And there are nascent independent movements (in Texas we have two credible independent candidates for governor, both of whom are likely to out-poll the Democratic Party nominee) which can be co-opted or cooperated with as a source of volunteers.  While many of the Perotistas have returned to their natural home in the GOP (including Perot&#8217;s 1992 campaign manager, who made an unfortunate pit stop as the 1994 Dem Senate nominee against Kay Bailey Hutchison, but who is now a prominent Republican, and ranking Federal Reserve official in Dallas), they and other disaffected voters are primed to move over the illegal immigration issue.</p>
<p>But when will they move?  In many states, including Texas, the filing deadline has passed.  Some of them may vote Dem this fall out of frustration, but the Democratic Party is no longer the natural home of anyone opposed to increased Balkanization of America.  In effect, I believe this gives the GOP two years to make a substantial move to the right on immigration enforcement.  The GOP may lose the House in the meantime, however, and that means that the amnesty forces will be the only Republicans with national power.  </p>
<p>The combination of these effects should propel Tom Tancredo (or someone very much like him) into the front rank of GOP presidential candidates in &#8216;08, though he will ultimately prove unsuccessful.  The question then for the GOP is: do they put Tancredo on the ticket in the number two spot, or do they risk the emergence of a third-party challenger on this issue, and lose enough votes (a la Perot) to guarantee a Hillary victory?</p>
<p>In any event, given the onerous requirements of signature gathering, a third party candidate (Chris Simcox, perhaps?) would have to begin organizing his/her efforts no later than the last quarter of &#8216;07.</p>
<p>Tying this issue to the bloat in the federal government, and making the point (as has been made recently by a number of Washington think-tanks and some conservative columnists and bloggers) that amnesty and increased immigration will bloat the welfare state and balloon its costs might give the third party not only more echo of Perot on the issues, but it would also serve to lance the claim of Republicans that they are the party of fiscal responsibility.  This would also bolster the candidacy of Hillary, as Bill presided over years of fiscal surplus.</p>
<p>In any event, it seems virtually impossible for the GOP to win in &#8216;08 without adopting the current House bill on immigration enforcement or something quite similar.  Amnesty (heavy or light) appears to be High-Caliber suicide.
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		<title>by: Texas Rainmaker</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4448</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 16:16:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4448</guid>
					<description>"&lt;i&gt;Problem is, this is what happened with Ross Perot, which got Bill Clinton elected. Could the same happen again and get Hilliary elected? &lt;/i&gt;"

Possibly, but here's why I think not.  Unlike Bill Clinton in 1992, Hillary in 2008 has 15+ years of interaction with the American public.  She's not an unknown... and what the country knows about her will likely be her biggest obstacle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;<i>Problem is, this is what happened with Ross Perot, which got Bill Clinton elected. Could the same happen again and get Hilliary elected? </i>&#8221;</p>
<p>Possibly, but here&#8217;s why I think not.  Unlike Bill Clinton in 1992, Hillary in 2008 has 15+ years of interaction with the American public.  She&#8217;s not an unknown&#8230; and what the country knows about her will likely be her biggest obstacle.
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		<title>by: Dede</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4444</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 16:09:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4444</guid>
					<description>Problem is, this is what happened with Ross Perot, which got Bill Clinton elected.  Could the same happen again and get Hilliary elected?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Problem is, this is what happened with Ross Perot, which got Bill Clinton elected.  Could the same happen again and get Hilliary elected?
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		<title>by: Super Fun Power Hour</title>
		<link>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4442</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Jun 2006 16:07:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.texasrainmaker.com/2006/06/01/time-for-a-third-party/#comment-4442</guid>
					<description>&lt;strong&gt;The Bleak Future of CanAmerExicoIstan&lt;/strong&gt;

Peggy Noonan's blood is boiling:

Something's happening. I have a feeling we're at some new beginning, that a big breakup's coming, and that though it isn't and will not be immediately apparent, we'll someday look back on this era as the time w...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>The Bleak Future of CanAmerExicoIstan</strong></p>
<p>Peggy Noonan&#8217;s blood is boiling:</p>
<p>Something&#8217;s happening. I have a feeling we&#8217;re at some new beginning, that a big breakup&#8217;s coming, and that though it isn&#8217;t and will not be immediately apparent, we&#8217;ll someday look back on this era as the time w&#8230;
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